Some thoughts and spec about Supernatural.

[apocalypsos]

EDIT: I should add that this is probably all bullshit. Ahem.

Okay, a couple of things:

1. The more time that passes, the more I believe --

a.) That's not Ruby. (Or at least, not the Ruby that was in Katie last season. It explains a lot.)
b.) She knows exactly what will happen if someone destroys Lilith.
c.) She's possibly been one of Lilith's posse all along.

Those are not exactly surprises. In fact, I'll be surprised if she turns out to have been the same Ruby we had last season, she really is on Sam's side, and she's been tricked. Because I don't buy for a second that last year's Ruby would have been tricked into getting Sam to kill Lilith without knowing what killing Lilith will lead to.

2. I suspect that might not be Castiel, either.

Now, admittedly that's a long shot. It probably is Castiel 1.0, the uptight douche who took over Jimmy's body in the first place. But I like him, so I tend to watch him raptly like an idiot (*dreamy eyes*), and there's just something not right about Castiel since he came back. Of course it's possible the heavenly ass-reaming did him in. I'm ... not entirely convinced yet.

What throws me off is that undoubtedly Anna would have noticed that wasn't Castiel in there. The only way this particular theory works is if whoever replaced Castiel were high enough on the social order that Anna didn't recognize them or could have been persuaded not to. Which means that someone higher up on the rungs wanted Sam out, wanted Sam to go drink more demon blood and head straight for Lilith, knowing full well what killing Lilith will lead to.

If that's true, that just means that both Heaven and Hell want an apocalypse, and the Winchesters got thrown into the mix whether they liked it or not.

If Heaven and Hell both want an apocalypse -- and that might not be true, which all depends on whether or not Castiel let Sam out of his own volition; I doubt that, though -- then it may take realizing they're not going to able to stop it to get Sam and Dean to have sense knocked into their heads. It's no wonder their relationship's in the state it's in if both sides don't give much of a shit about tearing them to pieces to get what they want. Which ... why would they, really? Two grown hunters are small potatoes when you already want to destroy the world anyway.

God is missing, or at least hasn't been seen in a while. The same can be said for Lucifer. It's been theorized that Lucifer will be drawn out by breaking the final seal. There are demons who have been actively trying for this since the first season. Breaking the final seal will draw out Lucifer and armageddon.

Who's to say the angels don't believe the same thing of God?

Considering the angels we've been getting, we'd probably end up getting Old Testament God who's a destructive douchebag if we get any at all. It's a scary thought, isn't it? Imagine you're an angel, you hate your annoying little brothers (the human race), and you just want Dad (God's righteous ass) to come home and spank the FUCK out of them. Hey, if you have to let your little brother blow up the house to get Dad to come the hell home and take care of business, what do you care?

This is what gets me -- that the angels HAVE to know what killing Lilith will do, and they're doing it anyway. If Bobby and Rufus can figure this shit out, the angels MUST know. They're creeping me out more than Ruby, Lilith and the rest of the demons are, because at least the demons have reason to lie to keep the apocalypse coming. The angels could say one simple thing -- kill Lilith, start the apocalypse -- and they won't. In fact, they've got Dean under their thumb to do the deed AND Castiel letting Sam out of the panic room. Fuck, who gives a shit if the Winchesters survive this, much less like each other afterwards? As long as one of them does the deed, right?

Having said that, I want to write fic.

Dude, I KNOW.

It's actually not as related to the rest of this post as you might think.

Comments

[seferin.livejournal.com]

Considering the angels we've been getting, we'd probably end up getting Old Testament God who's a destructive douchebag if we get any at all.

To be fair, the way that the Torah God is portrayed is actually a lot of propaganda. Yes, back in the day there was suffering, but the image of a jealous deity with anger management issues has been exasperated by Christianity in an attempt to claim they are better than the previous version, by attributing horrific crimes and actions to him.

The sense I got was that the four angels who have spoken to God have differing opinions on what He wants, thus causing this mess. The Angels are like Sam currently, thinking that as long as the bad guys lose, the ends justify the means. Remember, Castiel didn't say "Yes" he said "If you choose to see it that way". They didn't promise Sam would survive, or be healed, or recover. They promised that Sam would not have to kill Lilith. It's all about the fine print. I suspect they did what they did so that Dean would go all out, and thus they are pushing Sam to the edge (I think it was angels, not demons, Sam saw), in order to make Dean more willing to do what is needed to save him.

Sam thus becomes the carrot Dean chases, and in doing so, becomes also the stick to keep him in line.

[telaryn.livejournal.com]

Remember, Castiel didn't say "Yes" he said "If you choose to see it that way". They didn't promise Sam would survive, or be healed, or recover. They promised that Sam would not have to kill Lilith. It's all about the fine print.

This. And it is a testament to the caliber of Misha Collins' acting that I think this *is* Cas 1.0, and I think it's killing him to do what he's doing. The subtext was all there - he's right up there with the boys when it comes to subtlety of expression.

Anna had to be taken out of play because she would have gone straight to Dean with the intel that Cas had been the one to let Sam out. Knowing that, Dean never would have been able to swear service to heaven - and I do believe that heaven and hell need the Winchesters in play for this to happen.

Christ/Antichrist...it's mythologically sound for the direction they're heading.

This not being Ruby 1.0 I hadn't considered, but it definitely works. I automatically distrust anyone who conveniently disappears for a long stretch of time, and I do think she's enjoying his dependence on her more than Ruby 1.0 ever would have.

Even if it is Ruby 1.0, have we ever seen any indication that her ultimate agenda *wasn't* putting Sam on the throne of hell with herself as the power behind that throne?

[seferin.livejournal.com]

Could it be an issue with the body?

The body of a Coma victim likely would have more issues than the first body. Further, she had to do things to get back into Lilith's favor. She might have been weakened by doing so.

[telaryn.livejournal.com]

Oh it could be - no question. Ultimately I think it comes down to whether her value to the show's agenda is continuing as a grey-hat ally (that so doesn't look right spelled that way!) of the boys, or as somebody who's going to screw them over in the end?

Think about it...if she ends up screwing over Sam, the angst factor will be so staggeringly high it may take out a good 50% of the fandom. I can see where this would appeal to Kripke et al.

[seferin.livejournal.com]

I'd love to see the Two Rubys. See them fight to see who is actually believed. Because if the blood was all that was needed, then in theory Ruby could have just possessed a group of people, had them feed Sam blood, so he would be supercharged.

[foenix.livejournal.com]

"If that's true, that just means that both Heaven and Hell want an apocalypse"

DING DING DING.

Demons want it, because...well... ;)

The angels want it because there's rumblings of God being on vacation, and maybe hope to smoke him out. Or possibly, God is displeased, and figures it's time to burn the forest to the soil, and start fresh.

[loony-moony.livejournal.com]

You know, I would've gone with you on the That's Not Castiel theory, except there was a tiny tiny glimmer of him when Dean reams him for belittling whatever he was going to tell him in Illinois. Something in his eyes and his voice. IDK, IDK.

I've thought Ruby was in Lilith's posse since last season. In all honesty, I actually thought she was in YED's posse to begin with, and decided to work against Lilith because she didn't want her in charge.

[telaryn.livejournal.com]

Speaking of which - where is YED's hand in all this? Remember the time travel episode? "Like I'd tell you my endgame?" It was pretty clearly spelled out that AHBL 1/2 was *not* the end of that storyline.

[dmlpacker.livejournal.com]

You're post depresses me. Because it's so true. I really hope the Ruby of S4 isn't my Ruby from S3 (because I liked her then!).

The metaphor about the Angels and blowing up houses is amazing. It makes absolute sense :)